Procol Harum in Kristiansand, Norway

This is the full, uncut text of an interview given Gary Brooker and Matthew Fisher the evening of the Procol gig in Kristiansand, just after the Palers' Party. The interview was conducted by Christian Wulf from the local TV station TV-Sør. An edited version of it was broadcast on TV-Sør Monday 28 May.

A hotel lounge. Gary and Matthew recline, relaxed and exceptionally genial, on a settee of some sort. Gary occasionally sups a beer. Matthew gestures expressively with his left hand. In the background a cocktail pianist plays Memories from Cats … strangely almost appropriate

Christian Wulf
OK. What made you come to Kristiansand to do a concert?

Gary Brooker
(Grins) I don't know. I mean, Oslo would have been a bigger place. I think somebody got a bee in their bonnet here. And well ... here we are ... it doesn't matter, really ... what made us come to Kristiansand.

TV lighting flashes on and off

GB
Oh dear …

Matthew Fisher
You got a strobe!

Yes, strobe, a bit slow. But … er … do you know anything about Kristiansand?

MF
Nothing at all, only that it's in Norway. And I didn't know that till today.

GB
There's a ferry … you can get a ferry here … from Denmark.

But … erm … you know Jens Ravnaas. Do you think that maybe he could have played a part?

GB
Ah now. Yes I think Jens ... Jens Ravnaas, isn't it? ... he could have played a part because with the new 'information technology' and the internet which is global thing, the webmaster of the Procol Harum site is in fact from Kristiansand and is a brilliant guy, he's got a brilliant website going there … but he does it with another man in England, they don't have to be together to do it ... I don't know how it works ... but he's got a great site for Procol Harum fans. I think it's a bit of a thank-you, come up here and have a look-see where it all happens ... but it doesn't happen here really, it happens out in the ... (gestures) in the ether ... in the air

What if anything has Jens Ravnaas meant to Procol Harum lately ?

GB
Well .. is he a local hero or something? Or is he going to be?

We're trying to make him one!

GB
Well I think that ...um ... I think that he's tried to … well he's organised a concert here and that in fact ... well we said, 'We don't want to do one concert, get ... if we're gonna rehearse and come out and have a bit of fun, let's do at least a couple of weeks or something.' So it started that off. If nothing else.

Cocktail piano now playing You Are So Beautiful.

Now you're doing Norway, Denmark, then you're going to eastern Europe. Moscow, aren't you?

MF
(nods agreeably)

How come?

MF
(laughs) I'm not really the one to ask, I don't know; I'm just presented with a list of dates and say, 'This is what we're doing', and I turn up and I do them. But I ...

Is it special? Back in the days when you were ... (laughs) back in the early days, Russia would have been unthinkable, wouldn't it?

GB
Oh I think ... one thing Procol Harum has done throughout its life is always gone and played in the out-of-the-way places. I mean we did go to Poland in 1975; we've never been to Russia ...but if we'd've been asked to go in 1975 we'd have given it a go. But actually these places we're going, we're not going 'Hey, we want to go to Russia, hey, we want to go to Poland,' ... it's just that they've said, 'We'd like to have Procol Harum'. And that's why we're going there. I know as much as Matthew. I just knew it two weeks before, and he only knew it yesterday. (Laughs)

But I can't do this interview without talking about A Whiter Shade of Pale. Have you ever regretted that you wrote that one song, to overshadow all the other songs you've written?

GB
Oh I don't think ... let's look at it a different way, I mean it started the band going ... and opened a lot of doors for everybody, you know, so it was a bit of luck that it came out when it did. And it's always had that remarkable sound about it: the sound quality of the recording, the atmosphere, has lasted all this time, and it still sounds a different and interesting record today.

MF
I think, though, with the benefit of hindsight, it would've probably been better if it had been our second or third record.

GB
It would have been brilliant (both laugh)

MF
Unfortunately ... we all thought it was good, we thought it would be a hit, but I don't think we ever quite realised it would be … um … as massive as it was ... that did rather take us by surprise.

GB
Caught us with our pants down and we didn't even have any trousers, did we?

But er, this Hammond organ sound, which is very recognisable, I'm sure a lot of artists have tried to copy this later: it was you who invented it, wasn't it?

MF
Well I wouldn't say I invented the sound, because I mean I think really the sort of sound that I was going for there was more like a Booker T sound, it was the way I was using the sound that was perhaps a bit different ... but, um, you know I think that if I hadn't done it someone else would have come along so it was just ... I got in there first. It was just because I ... I ... I was very influenced by Bach organ works, you know, and I just wanted to sort of put a bit of that style in, you know, and that's just the way it happened. But there's ... the guy who … there's a guy plays in Crowded House ... someone sent .. a fan sent me a CD and said 'listen to this organist because he sounds just like you' and he does actually, it's .. I like it .. and I enjoy listening to him (nods toward Gary) as well, you know.

Tuxedo Junction wafts in from the next room.

You had a break for like 15 years from Procol Harum ... what made you start over again?

MF
It happened gradually, didn't it? I mean ... I left the band in '69 and went off and did all sorts of weird and wonderful things, um, and then Procol Harum itself stopped working about 19 …

GB + MF
… 77

MF
Yeah and then you g ... Gary and I didn't really see each other much … and then we got back together round 1983/1984 … something like that ... and we worked together on one of Gary's albums so that sort of got us back together, and then ... I don't quite know .. how did it ... get ... that we … the idea of reforming the band ...

GB

Ah well ... I think I said to Keith, 'Well what about making a Procol Harum record?'. 'Well yes, but what is it?' 'Well start off with some songs, see if we can write anything', we got a few ideas going, then say, 'Well what about … we'll see if Matthew ... what he's doing … you know and if wants to ...' and Matthew wasn't ... well he was probably doing something, but he said 'Yeah'. Matthew came down, and the three of us kind of sat round in my place, didn't we, and came up with some more ideas so we sort of proved to ourselves a bit that we yeah, (nods) something, this works a bit you know, the magic's still there.

You weren't afraid of being pathetic or it's like ... OK, here they go again, they're old now, and long for those times, and here they go again.

GB
Never even thought of that at all.

MF
I don't look at it like that because ... we don't do it all the time you know ... it's just that we do it when we feel like doing it … It's not like certain people that I could name that are still working in holiday camps doing their old sixties hits and that sort of thing, you know, because it's the only way they can make a living. And we don't need to do it to make a living. We do it 'cos we wanna do it.

GB
Mm (nods assent)

In what ways is Procol Harum different now than you were in the old days

GB
We're not. We're just better. More experienced. More mature. We're all better (both smile).

Rhapsodical piano in the background: Just the Way you Are.

About the fans ... what does it mean to you to have fans who have stuck with you for 34 years?

GB
Well that's ... well they must be as mad as we are.

MF
Not all of them are that old. I mean I think, some we've picked up along the way. Some are probably quite recent.

GB
Yeah, I mean I think Whiter Shade of Pale is still opening a few doors because it seems to get played on radio a lot still. I mean Norway recently on the adult channel, on the radio, I think they voted it 'best record of all time' [see here]. That's ever since stone-age man …

MF
(laughs)

GB
Right up until ... you know ... ever. And that wasn't just ... well let's say … people of 50 years old. There's a lot of other people have heard that and you know today it opens doors, it's great if somebody of twenty can hear that and see us on in Kristiansand or in Copenhagen ... 'Well, I like that, I've heard ... I'll go and see what they're like'. Yeah, 'cos we're also a band that can play and sing. You know. That's what we do.

What's the concert tonight going to be like … or what does it take for you to feel really confident or satisfied when you're done?

GB
A nice hot meal helps. That's all (hilarity of both). Yeah. The one I was due for an hour ago.

You don't expect the audience to go jumping and screaming in front of the stage any more?

GB
Ah, they've never jumped and screamed in front of the stage. This is Procol Harum, you've heard our stuff. Um, you know, it's in your spirit, you get moved. They'll be crying. They won't be dancing, they'll be crying (laughs).

MF
Or cheering.

GB
Or smiling. Smiling and cheering , smiling and cheering …