DMarch 1998: The Procol Harum e-mail List

Procol Harum

Beyond
the Pale

The Procol Harum e-mail list archive

March 1998 part (a) (thanks, Bill Hammell)

Date: Sun, 01 Mar 1998 15:10:47 +0000
To: procol@progrock.org
From: Roland Clare <roland.clare@virgin.net
Subject: Separation

IChippett wrote:
Has anybody actually seen this film? How did PH and MF get mixed up in it?
After all, at the time they were still relatively unknown, I would have
thought.

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Date: Sun, 1 Mar 1998 15:03:30 -0500 (EST)
From: Jem33@aol.com
To: greatsociety@worldnet.att.net, cerdes@procolharum.com
cc: Procol@progrock.org
Subject: Re: Re: The Return of the Dog

So, I'll finally get to hear the famous "Green Onions." (Joan May, you
always talked up this song, if I remember right!) I've never heard it
before, so I'm looking forward to it <<

GREAT!! Be sure to turn it up to at least ELEVEN for best effect!! That goes
for whoever posted that the performance wasn't earthshattering.. I didn't
think so either until I CRANKED IT UP!! Eat your heart out, Booker T. ! <G

BTW - Fisher has complained that guitarist Dick Taylor kinda stepped on his
organ lines a little but I don't agree - I LOVE Taylor's playing and don't
think it interfered with MF's glorious Hammond at all!! Now if you want to
hear a tasteless heavyhanded guitar player steppintg all over MF's Hammond
(on AWSoP ) check out Geoff Whitefhorn on that Johnny Carson appearance!!
Makes you wish that one of those giant hook had come onstage and dragged GW
away!

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Date: Sun, 1 Mar 1998 15:09:14 -0500 (EST)
From: Jem33@aol.com
To: greatsociety@worldnet.att.net, cerdes@procolharum.com
cc: Procol@progrock.org
Subject: Fisher's HOT GREEN ONIONS!!

I'll get this right yet! I wanted to send the following to Everyone, and
with the above Subject line.. But only Diane got the Subject title change, so
here it is again.. sorry 'bout that! I added a bit to compensate for my
repetition...

So, I'll finally get to hear the famous "Green Onions." (Joan May, you
always talked up this song, if I remember right!) I've never heard it
before, so I'm looking forward to it <<

BTW - Fisher has complained that guitarist Dick Taylor kinda stepped on his
organ lines a little but I don't agree - I LOVE Taylor's playing - akin the
the great Mike Bloomfield in his Butterfield Band Days!! :-) -- and don't
think it interfered with MF's glorious Hammond at all!!

Now if you want to hear a tasteless heavyhanded guitar player steppintg all
over MF's Hammond (on AWSoP ) check out Geoff Whitefhorn on that Johnny
Carson appearance!! Makes you wish that one of those giant hooks had come
onstage and dragged GW away!

I'm so glad that Mick G. played with PH at Redhill!! Now Why didn't they get
HIM in 1991 when RT quit?? I'll never understand that one....

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From: CERDES96 <cerdes@procolharum.com
Date: Sun, 1 Mar 1998 23:10:00 EST
To: Procol@Progrock.org
Subject: Democracy as alternative Procol

I may be having a moment of madness writing this, but
it's really a shame that Copping/Grabham and Ball were not up to the level or
their predecessors. It would have been glorious to have a Procol in the vein
of Gentle Giant or Genesis where all forces were equal as they were in the
beginning sans David Knights. That band never really seemed to work as a
collective except for those 2 1/2 years in the 60's. Shame really. Though the
stuff is top notch by and large, Procol's Ninth would NEVER have materialized
within a democratic band framework. Could you imagine Peter Gabriel or Tony
Banks allowing Eight Days a Week on Foxtrot? NEVER HAPPEN..... Unless PH were
all so burnt out at that point it didn't matter. Brooker said that album had
DREK on it. I do agree. But most of PH IS like Fine Wine and dover sole. I am
waiting to have my head served on silver plate beneath chandelier. Lets see
what happens if anything ~~~CERDES96~~~<---friend not foe
:+)
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From: IChippett <IChippett@aol.com
Date: Mon, 2 Mar 1998 01:49:00 EST
To: procol@progrock.org
Subject: A Salty Dog Returns

I second CERDES entirely about this one. As I said once before, "Nutrocker"
should have been a Number One single for at least a year. My youngest son
played it for days and said it was his favourite song ever, even more than "I
Get Around" (it's the Spice Girls now but anyway...). Are they real drums BTW
on this track? They certainly sound like it. The parody tracks are perfect too
so buy it (but don't expect Repent Walpurgis!)

Ian C
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From: CERDES96 <cerdes@procolharum.com
Date: Mon, 2 Mar 1998 02:25:11 EST
To: IChippett@aol.com, Procol@Progrock.org
Subject: Drums on: A Salty Dog Returns

<< Are they real drums BTW
on this track? meaning Nutrocker from A Salty Dog Returns.........

No....all the drumming is done on sampler/synths. The sounds
are totally authentic. My synth has amazing drum sounds and programmed right
or played deftly, the difference is subtle if unnoticeable. All that is left
is putting some identity into the drumming. I think Matt's drum parts were
well conceived and executed. cerdes96
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Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 18:43:10 +0100
From: Frank Matheus <matheus@uni-muenster.de
X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [de] (Win95; I)
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: CERDES96 <cerdes@procolharum.com
CC: Procol@progrock.org
Subject: Re: Democracy as alternative Procol
X-Priority: 3 (Normal)
References: <8ba91c14.34fa311b@aol.com
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I may be having a moment of madness writing
this, but it's really a shame that Copping/Grabham and Ball were not up to the
level or their predecessors. It would have been glorious to have a Procol in
the vein of Gentle Giant or Genesis where all forces were equal as they were in
the beginning sans David Knights. That band never really seemed to work as
a collective except for those 2 1/2 years in the 60's. Shame really.
Though the stuff is top notch by and large, Procol's Ninth would NEVER have
materialized within a democratic band framework. Could you imagine Peter Gabriel or
Tony Banks allowing Eight Days a Week on Foxtrot? NEVER HAPPEN..... Unless
PH were all so burnt out at that point it didn't matter. Brooker said that
album had DREK on it. I do agree. But most of PH IS like Fine Wine and dover
sole. I am waiting to have my head served on silver plate beneath chandelier.
Lets see what happens if anything ~~~CERDES96~~~<---friend
not foe
:+)

if I liked the Beatles, I possibly would listen to "Eight days a week".
But I don't, so I don't. BUT: Played by Procol Harum, the song wins much
of musicality. The band often plays rock'n'roll tunes as an encore in
their live-concerts, and due to the fact that I hate rock'n'roll, I must
admit, that even "Blue suede shoes" work. It is the blues, that Mr
Brooker adds to songs like this.
I don't think that Procol's ninth is a bad album, I even like "The worm
and the tree" on their next album (I just listen to the music and ignore
the words). On Procol's ninth we find four of the best Brooker-Reid
compositions (the first four songs) and the interesting cover version
of "I keep forgetting". (At the same time, 1975, Roger Chapman's solo
album "Chappo" was released, and he covered the song, too. My girl
friend at that time liked the version of Chappo best, so I had to leave
her. Unfortunately she kept my first PH album, the
180g-Vinyl-Decca-edition of AWSoP).
On all of PH albums there are weak tracks - and that means tracks, that
I like less than other songs. Other auditors may have other choices, but
I think there is always a sectional plane of songs that all serious
listeners love, on Procol's ninth e.g. "Fool's gold" or "Taking the
time".
BTW, the sound on Procol's ninth is overwhelming good, much better than
their studio work in the nineties, like Prodigal stranger.

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From: Dave Lee <d.lee@kudos.co.uk
To: "'procol@progrock.org'" <procol@progrock.org
Subject: RE: Separation
Date: Mon, 2 Mar 1998 10:25:57 -0000

Is it possible that Shine On (or someone) could get hold of a copy of
Separation that they could sell on to PH fans, like the recent excellent
"Making of the Home album" video? How would we go about doing this? Who
would we talk to? Afterall, if it exists it's just sitting in vault
somewhere doing nothing but rot.

davelee
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From: Dave Lee <d.lee@kudos.co.uk
To: "'Procol@Progrock.org'" <Procol@Progrock.org
Subject: RE: Democracy as alternative Procol
Date: Mon, 2 Mar 1998 10:32:13 -0000

I'm curious. I've heard people say that David Knights was the weak link
in a classic PH line-up. What is the evidence against him? Do we have a
consensus over who was PH's finest bassist? Chris Copping?

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From: Dave Lee <d.lee@kudos.co.uk
To: "'procol@progrock.org'" <procol@progrock.org
Subject: RE: A Salty Dog Returns
Date: Mon, 2 Mar 1998 10:46:21 -0000

Matthew's Greens Onions originally appeared CD "United" by The British
Invasion All-Stars (members of Yardbirds, Pretty Things, Pirates etc).
The Green Onions track later appearing on Matthew's album A Salty Dog
Returns (which I think is on the same label). Matthew plays Hammond
throughout United. It's mainly R & B standards. It's on Promised Land
246890, and was the second All-Stars CD. I have an address you can try
to get a copy, but it was about 3-4 years ago: Brisk Productions, 102
Dorset House, Gloucester Place, London NW1 5AG, England.

It was in the same vein as A Whiter Shade of Dirty Water CD by Procol
Harum/Pretty Things/etc, mainly Matthew Fisher and friends.

It is Bill Wyman's part time band: Gary Brooker, Andy Fairweather Low,
Graham Broad, Jerry Henderson, Terry Taylor and Bill Wyman of course.

It was recorded live in Sweden for Swedish radio, and available on
Sequel Records (part of Castle Communications plc). It was recorded in
July 1992, and released in 1994. Gary sings lead on most of the tracks
(& keyboards on all), which are old rockers like Staggerlee, High School
Confidential. 12 tracks in all. Normally, I'm not too keen on this sort
of CD, but it's really great !!! Get it while you can. Its catalogue
number is: NEM CD 689.

davelee
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Date: Mon, 2 Mar 1998 13:21:21 +0300 (GMT)
To: procol@progrock.org
From: marpe@brecha.com.uy (Marcelo Pereira)
Subject: Democracy

About MF & RT, I fully agree: with all due respect to others, what they
gave to the band's unusual balance was never 'replaced', though PH kept
being a great group (anyway, can we say the band was 'democratic' before
they left?). BUT I keep forgiving Eight Days a Week and think Ninth is a
great underestimated album (lyrics & music). Marcelo

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Date: Mon, 02 Mar 1998 19:22:09 +0000
To: <Procol@progrock.org
From: Roland Clare <roland.clare@virgin.net
Subject: defending Good Sir Galant

Dave Lee wrote:
I'm curious. I've heard people say that David Knights was the weak link in
a classic PH line-up.

I always enjoyed his recorded playing enormously; because of him I took up
the bass, listening to the LPs at 45 rpm and the singles at 78 in order to
figure out exactly how he extracted a melodic line from those chord sequences.

In my Redhill report (http://www.procolharum.com/redhill12.htm) I wrote (re
the bassline of 'Shine on Brightly') "I'd love to know if these parts were
Dave Knights's invention, or if the distinctive chord-inversions were
intrinsic to Gary Brooker's conception of the song."

Gary appears to answer that question in the Repertoire 'Home' liner notes:
"He was a good man, Dave Knights, and he'd always played the bass notes I
told him to, so he'd done a great job!"

(Maybe there's some evidence against Denny Cordell, for leaving that bass
blunder in 'Cerdes' (2 mins 40 seconds in, or so!)

I never heard Dave Knights in the flesh. Perhaps he simply didn't have the
technique or the imagination to keep up with the developing virtuosity of
his fellow-players. But before we consign him to the history's bass bin,
maybe we should consider that 'his' fault may actually have been a built-in
feature of those carefully-arranged early songs: maybe he sounded
predictable because the composer was demanding certain notes of him.

After he leaves, the 'Home' and (especially) 'Barricades'-era songs are
mutating more towards 'guessable' chords in root-position: it seems that
they are designed more for extended rocking-out (not that 'Walpurgis' and
'Kaleidoscope' aren't). Perhaps this development came about because Chris
knew how to improvise and Dave didn't? I don't know.

Dave Bronze has fantastic taste and restraint and he plays some wonderful
runs, but it's not quintessential PH bass-playing; Chris Copping was BassMan
of the Match at Redhill for my money: the energy he gives out is amazing.

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Date: Tue, 03 Mar 1998 00:19:33 +0100
From: Jens Anders Ravnaas <jensan@online.no
To: Dave Lee <d.lee@kudos.co.uk
CC: "'procol@progrock.org'" <procol@progrock.org
Subject: Re: A Salty Dog Returns

I bought that CD from CD-Now a few weeks ago. It is recommended!
--
Shine On!
Jens

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jens Anders Ravnaas - Kristiansand - Norway

Life is like a beanstalk. Isn't it?
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

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From: CERDES96 <cerdes@procolharum.com
Date: Mon, 2 Mar 1998 18:27:11 EST
To: Procol@Progrock.org
Subject: Re: 4 strings

<< n a message dated 98-03-02 16:47:48 EST, you write:

<< never heard Dave Knights in the flesh. Perhaps he simply didn't have the
technique or the imagination to keep up with the developing virtuosity of
his fellow-players. But before we consign him to the history's bass bin,
maybe we should consider that 'his' fault may actually have been a built-in
feature of those carefully-arranged early songs: maybe he sounded
predictable because the composer was demanding certain notes of him.

              I saw him in '69 abd he sounded just like his recorded parts
really. The Central Park 69 tape and the BBC session are representative. The
thing with him was that he had no sense of real funk so to speak. He was
plodding and methodical and in some pieces it would have been nice to have a
more expansive looping bass system happening. GB did say that he was not a
facile improviser. Listen to the fluidity of QRS on the Beat Club Video as
opposed to Knights jumpy version. The whole rhythmn section changed with his
departure. With Copping and it evolved further. Then with Cartright who was
quite adept and improvisatory in his "approach" if not in playing different
things all the time. Just a different slant on the same fantastic songs. Can't
ruin them really eh wot?        CERDES96
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From: Strings334 <Strings334@aol.com
Date: Tue, 3 Mar 1998 01:42:05 EST
To: procol@progrock.org
Subject: democracy

I always thought that there was a message from the ninth album. The
Lieber/Stoller song and the McCartney/Lennon tunes wrapped PH compositions
such as "Without A Doubt" that spoke of the difficulty of actually creating
something. I don't think it a mere coincidence that these two songs were by
two of the most prolific song teams ever. Anyway I have always thought that
there was greater meaning to the reason these two songs were on the album. I
personally like the ninth, as well as the rest of them.
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From: "MIKAEL WERKELIN" <mikael.werkelin@mbox301.swipnet.se
To: "procol list" <procol@progrock.org
Subject: Strauss
Date: Tue, 3 Mar 1998 21:51:09 +0100

Hi!
A long time ago I bought an album just because Procol Harum performs on =
one track. The album contains music by Johann Strauss performed by =
Austrian musicians + Procol. Procol plays a 6:19 long and fantastic =
instrumental Blue Danube. The record is from 1975. Has anyone heard the =
track or heard about it and how it comes Procol perfomed on an otherwise =
all Austrian record?

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From: WRES2345 <WRES2345@aol.com
Date: Tue, 3 Mar 1998 16:20:47 EST
To: mikael.werkelin@mbox301.swipnet.se, procol@progrock.org
Subject: Re: Strauss and Motown

Procol played Blue Danube during the "Ninth" Tour, in Germany, I think. It
followed "I Keep Forgetting" and preceded Smokey Robinson's "I Can't Help
Myself" which then led into "Nothing Butt The Truth". My tape of BD runs over
8 minutes, and you're right, it's great stuff, isn't it? My favorite non-PH
written song that I've heard them perform, though, is "My Girl". Fantastic
rendition.
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Date: Tue, 03 Mar 1998 22:42:04 +0000
To: procol@progrock.org
From: Roland Clare <roland.clare@virgin.net
Subject: Strauss und Trivia

And in the UK: London, Bournemouth and Aylesbury at least; at the last of
which I remember a glitterball illuminating huge clumps of ungainly waltzers.

Trivia question: what 'oldie', featured live by PH at about the same time,
was written seven years before 'The Blue Danube'? (and I'm not thinking of
Giazotto's 'Adagio di Albinoni')

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From: CERDES96 <cerdes@procolharum.com
Date: Tue, 3 Mar 1998 18:38:34 EST
To: WRES2345@aol.com, Procol@Progrock.org
Subject: Tracks/Detroit

<< My favorite non-PH
written song that I've heard them perform, though, is "My Girl". Fantastic
rendition.

I agree. Ever hear gary sing "Tracks of My Tears" ? Fantastic...it's on
a video of him playing at the 100Club with Chris Spedding and friends.
cerdes96
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Date: Wed, 04 Mar 1998 00:03:40 +0100
From: Jens Anders Ravnaas <jensan@online.no
To: Roland Clare <roland.clare@virgin.net
CC: procol@progrock.org
Subject: Re: Strauss und Trivia

Trivia question: what 'oldie', featured live by PH at about the same time,
was written seven years before 'The Blue Danube'? (and I'm not thinking of
Giazotto's 'Adagio di Albinoni')

'This Old Dog' was a popular live feature at about the same time, and I guess thats an old
song.
--
Shine On!
Jens

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jens Anders Ravnaas - Kristiansand - Norway

Life is like a beanstalk. Isn't it?
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
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From: IChippett <IChippett@aol.com
Date: Wed, 4 Mar 1998 02:19:45 EST
To: procol@progrock.org
Subject: Departures

Can anyone tell me why Chris Copping and, earlier, Alan Cartright left the
band? Did someone make them an offer they couldn't refuse? It seems strange
that they would give up what must have been a good gig, at the very least, for
apparent obscurity. Can't believe it was "musical differences."

Ian C
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From: CERDES96 <cerdes@procolharum.com
Date: Wed, 4 Mar 1998 07:47:32 EST
To: IChippett@aol.com, Procol@Progrock.org
Subject: Re: Departures

<< Can anyone tell me why Chris Copping and, earlier, Alan Cartright left the
band?

Copping left due to "exhaustion" before the American tour in
77....Translation: too much booze. Pete Solley said he was getting "loopy"
Cartright opened his own pub but I'm not sure that's why he
left........HICCUP!!!! Larry
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Date: Wed, 4 Mar 1998 15:58:10 +0100
To: <procol@progrock.org
From: jonas@procolharum.com (Jonas Söderström)
Subject: Re: Blue Danube

And in the UK: London, Bournemouth and Aylesbury at least; at the last of
which I remember a glitterball illuminating huge clumps of ungainly waltzer=
s.

And in Stockholm, too - at the Konserthuset - complete with the glittering
ball! As I remeber it, that piece got the most applause during the
evening.

Fellow swedes on the list, do you think we could find out when and where
PH did play in Sweden? The "9th" tour in Stockholm circa 1975, in Stockholm
again during the "Prodigal" tour - and I know they played at Borgholms
castle in Oland some summer in the early 70ties.

------------------------------------------------------------------
Jonas Söderström                                     Phone: +46-8-566 30 921
X kommunikation                 Fax: +46-8-33 73 67
Galvleg 22                       e-mail: jonas@procolharum.com
S-113 82 Stockholm
Sweden

Home: Phone and fax: +46-8-744 24 91
Selmedalsringen 16 e-mail: jonas@comedia.se
S-129 36 Hägersten
Sweden
------------------------------------------------------------------
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Date: Wed, 4 Mar 1998 13:30:29 -0500 (EST)
From: Jem33@aol.com
To: jonas@procolharum.com, procol@progrock.org
Subject: Re: Re: Blue Danube

Blue Danube is on that wonderful London 1976 radio show - British Biscuit..
That's one of the tapes I play most often and wish would be excerpted for
Bonus Tracks on a PH CD reissue, or a LIVE Vinatage Non-orchestral release!
My FAVES on there:

ASD - the BEST recorded version of the song I've ever heard - BJ was
Brilliant throughout - ending the song with a "fluttering birds" effect on
the cymbals - with thankfully No Dopey Bird Sound-Effects getting in the way.
Also - All This and More - again - BJ was magnificent - &again esp. on the
Ending - duetting with Mick.. That brassy stuff at the end of the album
version Ruined the song for me.. After the last drum roll on the Brit Biscuit
version - Gary can be heard to say quickly and quietly:

There are also excellent versions of Conquistador and I Keep Forgetting (!)..
I didn't care for the AWSoP for reasons that are probably obvious to most of
you by now <G and also BJ has played that song better on other occasions..

Best, Joan
"....And the face of Alice Ghostly
Turned a Wyatt Earp shade of pale..."

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From: CERDES96 <cerdes@procolharum.com
Date: Wed, 4 Mar 1998 13:39:36 EST
To: Jem33@aol.com, Procol@Progrock.org
Subject: Ghostly Earp

<< "....And the face of Alice Ghostly
Turned a Wyatt Earp shade of pale..."

Were they "seeing" each other???? :+) cerdes96
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Date: Wed, 4 Mar 1998 13:47:09 -0500 (EST)
From: Jem33@aol.com
To: IChippett@aol.com, procol@progrock.org
Subject: Re: Departures

Can anyone tell me why Chris Copping and, earlier, Alan Cartright left the
band?<<

I think Cerdes already answered about CC - I've heard the same thing, can't
remember where. Don't know aobut AC - and I NEVER notice the bass playing in
PH -- there's so much fantastic musicianship in this band that it's possible
to focus just on one or 2 players and not even notice the great chops of the
others.. e.g I just became an MF fan during the past 2 years - had always
focused before on the voice, guitar and drums - and also had been MISLED into
thinking much of MF's work was Gary's ......Grrrrrrrr.......But I STILL don't
notice Anything about bass players!

I just found out recently - via an interesting interview with Mick at - --
where else? -- BtP (Thanks one more time, Jens and Roland!!!!! :-) ) --
that he LEFT PH in 1977 - Before the whole group broke up.. I'm beginning to
think that Mick's leaving may have been the "final straw" in the group's
disbanding -- it would've been Really Hard to find another guitarist for PH
-- Not an Easy GIG!! I think MG was a FINE PH guitarist, btw... Mick didn't
give any specific reasons for his leaving, but I just heard a fascinating
LIVE show from 5/77 --- WLIR/FM, Hofstra University, NY.. BJ sounded
absolutely out of this World!! - I think this may be the Best I've EVER
heard him recorded YET -- and he did a great Drum Solo at the end of Unquiet
Zone!! The others sounded great too - EXCEPT for that *&^^%%^&** SYNTH!!!!
I'd only heard tell about this before - Many fans complained about it -- but
now I understand on a visceral level... What an abomination to have infested
PH!!! Gary has great musical ears -- Why couldn't he hear how horrible that
sounded??? So I wonder if Mick couldn've left because he just couldn't stand
to listen to that wretched thing for one more minute....It's such a Shame
too, because the Rest of the band was at its PEAK in 1977!! :-( :

Best, Joan
"...And the face of Alice Ghostly
Turned a Wyatt Earp shade of Pale."

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From: CERDES96 <cerdes@procolharum.com
Date: Wed, 4 Mar 1998 14:24:07 EST
To: Jem33@aol.com, Procol@Progrock.org
Subject: Fwiddy Fwow!! Oscillators!

<< Why couldn't he hear how horrible that (synth)
sounded??? So I wonder if Mick couldn've left because he just couldn't stand
to listen to that wretched thing for one more minute.

I LOVE when you go off like that!!!!!!!!!! Cerdes96
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From: "MIKAEL WERKELIN" <mikael.werkelin@mbox301.swipnet.se
To: <procol@progrock.org
Subject: SV: Blue Danube
Date: Wed, 4 Mar 1998 21:18:52 +0100

I've got a tape somewhere of a show from Konserthuset in Stockholm
(Swedish radio broadcast) from 1972 I think because Dave Ball is on guitar.
/Micke, Gotland, Sweden

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From: IChippett <IChippett@aol.com
Date: Wed, 4 Mar 1998 17:21:01 EST
To: procol@progrock.org
Subject: Blue Danube

I definitely remember PH playing "Blue Danube" in the middle of "Grand Hotel"
either in Bristol or Birmingham. It replaced quite adequately the instrumental
bit in the middle of this song.

I have a silly question (yet another). What is the first recorded PH track on
which Gary B doesn't sing or play?

Ian C
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Date: Wed, 4 Mar 1998 23:24:14 +0100
To: procol@progrock.org
From: Christina <setters@bitsmart.com
Subject: PH in Sweden

Fellow swedes on the list, do you think we could find out when and where PH
did play in Sweden? The "9th" tour in Stockholm circa 1975, in Stockholm
again during the "Prodigal" tour - and I know they played at Borgholms
castle in =D6land some summer in the early 70ties.

And they also played in Gothenburg (G=F6teborg) at Liseberg 68 or maybe
"in the summer of '69."
I spent the whole day listening to the rehearsal before the concert...and
btw... that's when KR (dressed in a loooooong purple robe)
gave me BJ:s drumsticks and he signed them! What a Kick for a young fan!
- although I was mostly high on - focused at, carried away by - MF:s way
to "handle" the organ! ;-)
(ummm....I wasn't the only one *high* that day......eeeerrrr)

The next time I saw them live they had the good taste of performing on my
40th Birthday -
at the Gothenburg Concert House in January - 92. Nice way of celebraying,
eh? ;-)
A Great gig it was too!!
Cherio All!
/Christina

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From: CERDES96 <cerdes@procolharum.com
Date: Wed, 4 Mar 1998 17:39:42 EST
To: IChippett@aol.com, Procol@Progrock.org
Subject: Unsilent Brooker

<< I have a silly question (yet another). What is the first recorded PH track
on
which Gary B doesn't sing or play?

That does not exist though there are sections of pieces where
he is silent. Even when singing was done by Matthew or Robin, Gary was listed
as having played an instrument which one could hear in the mix such as "three
stringed guitar"...recorder etc. On Song for a Dreamer from BB, Gary is heard
on electric paino softly in the background. And so it was..........CERDES 96
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Date: Wed, 4 Mar 1998 19:07:55 -0500 (EST)
From: Jem33@aol.com
To: roland.clare@virgin.net, cerdes@procolharum.com, Procol@progrock.org
Subject: Re: Re: Remember this??

Btw are you sure that GB plays on Hesperus or Progress? I have always
guessed that he didn't <<

Here's a thought -- in addition to having KR correct all the Words, how about
having the musicians - e.g. MF etc -- correct all the musician-credit
oversights on the albums - esp. the first 3? I always assumed that was Gary
on piano on PP, but now that you mention it - maybe it Was MF.. I *actually*
thought until VERY recently that GARY played piano on Grand Finale and
Hesperus!!! Silly Me!!!!! Sheesh! <G...

As y'all know, lack of accurate crediting of musicians is a pet peeve of
mine, and it goes FAR beyond PH... though PH is my main concern of course..

So - maybe you BtP Webmasters can ask MF to annotate his credits for the
first 3?

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From: CERDES96 <cerdes@procolharum.com
Date: Wed, 4 Mar 1998 19:55:25 EST
To: Procol@Progrock.org
Subject: Re: Remember this??

<< Btw are you sure that GB plays on Hesperus or Progress? I have always
guessed that he didn't

I am convinced he plays piano on Progress and acoustic guitaron
Hesperus...but Matthew or gary would really have the answer IF thay can
remember........maybe we shall know soon? Cerdes96
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From: CERDES96 <cerdes@procolharum.com
Date: Wed, 4 Mar 1998 20:03:48 EST
To: Jem33@aol.com, Procol@Progrock.org
Subject: Anatomy and sundries

In a message dated 98-03-04 19:40:22 EST, you write:
<< You mean KR DIDN'T write "my cock is like a unicorn"???? Omigod! <G...
So how much is a plane ticket to Cerdes? <VBG
But seriously -- can you cite the reference for the above extraordinary
quote? Inquiring minds want to know the Whole Truth!

I just spoke with Keith :+) (OH REALLY???). He assures me the
correct line is "My penis resembles Guatamale." Sorry to dissapoint everyone.
That reference is from Procol Harum-Its only Realism at BTP. The pics from the
article should be up soon I believe. I thought that YOU sent that article to
BTP Jem...guess I was MISTOOK. Sorry...all plane service to Cerdes has been
cancelled unril further notice....(VVBG) Cerdes96
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From: IChippett <IChippett@aol.com
Date: Thu, 5 Mar 1998 03:59:14 EST
To: procol@progrock.org
Cc: cerdes@procolharum.com
Subject: Invisible Gary

A trick question, of course. I don't think GB can be heard on "Grand Hotel" on
the Symphonic PH. It's not really a PH record but anyway...

I too would like to know who plays exactly what on each of their albums. For
instance, who are all the voices on "Good Captain Clack"? Not just GB, is it?

Ian C
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Date: Thu, 5 Mar 1998 08:39:10 -0800 (PST)
From: Roger A McGuire <uj836@victoria.tc.ca
To: Procol@progrock.org
Subject: Introduction - Roger McGuire

Hello! I have been on the PH mailing list for awhile now, and decided the
time has come to introduce myself. I have been a diehard fan of PH since
about 3 oclock in the morning sometime in 1974 - having fallen asleep with
the radio on, I woke up during Whaling Stories. That was it - I had to
chase down all the lps I could find.

My first opportunity of seeing the band live was supposed to be in the
spring of 1977 in Ottawa, but the concert and maybe the rest of the 1977
North American tour after the Hofstra performance got cancelled. That has
always been my impression, but maybe I am wrong.

I finally did see PH for the one and only time in Vancouver in 1991. I
found out about the Edmonton Symphony reunion concert when it was over!

Has anybody ever constructed a comprehensive list of gigs the band played?
I would be really interested to see one. Someone at the Vancouver show
told me he saw PH in Vietnam on a USO tour - and how Conquistador on that
occasion had a huge impact on him.

My favourite PH song is probably Whaling Stories, but I like a lot of
others - especially the classically influenced numbers and the cover
versions like Danube, Also Sprach Zarathustra and Funeral Music For Queen
Mary etc. The music is what I really listen for - lyrics tend have very
little impact on me.

Apart from PH, I am also into Jean Michel Jarre, Genesis (70s only), Peter
Gabriel, David Bowie and Ultravox - in a more major way than a lot of
other stuff. In the 70s my other favourite band was Ekseption. Like PH,
they did a lot of great rock versions of classical masterpieces but with
more of a jazz feel. They did a brilliant Sabre Dance - so did Dave
Edmunds with Love Sculpture. That is one piece I thought Procol should
have covered too.

I began collecting live tapes and bootlegs etc. in the late 70s when they
were considerably harder to chase down than they are now. I have traded
with some of you on this list - and I have acquired some great stuff I
never knew existed - just in the last 3 years. I am always looking for
more - especially quality audience, fm or soundboard recordings of any
era.

On another musical note: I also am the leader (pipe major) of a reserve
army pipe band here in Victoria (British Columbia, Canada), which some
would say does not mean I should consider myself a musician. I also
dabble a bit with synthesizers - and some call that a non-musical pursuit
too! However, the music of PH has played a big part in my life and in
years to come I think they - like a lot of composers and artists before
them - will be given more recognition for excellence and influence on
music in this century than they now have, and not for just being the
creators of AWSOP. Just my prediction.

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Date: Thu, 05 Mar 1998 18:57:54 +0000
To: Procol@progrock.org
From: Roland Clare <roland.clare@virgin.net
Subject: Re: Introduction - Roger McGuire

The music is what I really listen for - lyrics tend have very little impact
on me.

They did a brilliant Sabre Dance - so did Dave Edmunds with Love Sculpture.
That is one piece I thought Procol should have covered too.

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From: WRES2345 <WRES2345@aol.com
Date: Thu, 5 Mar 1998 23:52:07 EST
To: mikael.werkelin@mbox301.swipnet.se, procol@progrock.org
Subject: Re: Ah, So Sweet

The following little incident is a true story that happened to me this week.
Having just purchased a new computer with a great sound system, I was dismayed
that the sound went bad after only a few days. It appears that one of the
kids software programs I added overwrote the drivers. After numerous
correspondences with Dell support and even a few MHM on aol, I was able to get
sound restored yesterday. In celebration, I put on a new CD I wanted to hear
by Tindersticks. My 10 year old daughter, who attended her first concert last
summer (Redhill), and who like many her age, is infatuated with The Spice
Girls and The Hansons, said "Dad, that music's yucky, put on Procol Harum." I
was so proud. (And I immediately did, of course.)
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Date: Fri, 6 Mar 1998 11:39:18 +0300 (GMT)
To: WRES2345 <WRES2345@aol.com
From: marpe@brecha.com.uy (Marcelo Pereira)
Subject: Re: Ah, So Sweet
Cc: procol@progrock.org

I've never heard Tindersticks, but that little girl of yours has sense &
sensibility indeed!
Marcelo

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Date: Fri, 6 Mar 1998 13:38:10 -0500
To: WRES2345@aol.com
From: Alan Semok <asemok@IDT.NET
Subject: Re: Ah, So Sweet
Cc: <procol@progrock.org

WRES 2345 wrote (clipped);
<<My 10 year old daughter, who attended her first concert last
summer (Redhill), and who like many her age, is infatuated with The Spice
Girls and The Hansons, said "Dad, that music's yucky, put on Procol Harum."

Hi Wres...
Congratulations to you on what can only be described as very successful and
high quality parenting! And congrats to your daughter on her discerning
and ultimately utterly fine taste in music. There may be some hope for the
world after all...
best,
AL
(aka Tausendsas@aol.com)

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From: TBren80504 <TBren80504@aol.com
Date: Fri, 6 Mar 1998 21:13:45 EST
To: Procol@progrock.org
Subject: PH Media Exposure

Any vehicle for Procol Harum enthusiasts to get together continues to be
a worthy idea. And it has been satisfying to see that this location has done
so well for PH and their devoted fans; quite rightly so.

Like others who visit here, my view is that PH --quite possibly-- is the
most underrated and underplayed progressive band of the past 31 years. And
while it is not probable that the masses will ever appreciate the depth and
scope of the band's creative works, PH ranks among the greats of their era,
influenced their contemporaries and, without a doubt, deserve much greater
media exposure. The band already has dedicated fans and critical respect.

I only wish that PH could become the subject of all the media awareness
that popular culture has to offer, so that they could get the attention they
still deserve.
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Date: Sat, 07 Mar 1998 16:39:29 +1000
To: procol@progrock.org
From: greg smith <gsmith@connexus.apana.org.au
Subject: Procol Harum - questions

After a brief intro post, some lurking and a good read of the archives at
Beyond The Pale it is about time I started participating in discussions.

I have a series of questions that all relate to adding to my collection of
PH recordings but to keep my posts short(ish) I'll stick to one question at
a time. Others to follow.

I am seriously considering buying the 30th Anniversary 3CD set and even
contemplating the new release of Shine On Brightly. Why? I have all of
the official CD's from Procol Harum to The Long Goodbye plus some best ofs
that pick up stray b-sides etc.

The reviews of the anniversary set seem to be mixed! I would appreciate
some honest opinions as to whether the additional tracks are worth it and
whether the remix/remastering adds anything to the first four albums.

Also is Il Tuo Diamante (sp?) worth the cost of a CD? I would like to own
a complete collection of PH tracks but economic sense comes into play
sometimes.

Finally I have heard some rumours that there may be a single CD released
containing rare tracks and B-Sides. Presumably this could be based on the
3rd CD in the Anniversary set. Is this an accurate rumour?

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From: hani@pacific.net.sg
Date: Sat, 7 Mar 1998 16:33:19 +0800 (SGT)
To: procol@progrock.org
Subject: Re: Procol Harum - questions

IMO, the 3rd disc"Rarities" alone is worth the price. My critisism is that
only the 1st disc has liner notes. And also the sound quality is a bit thin
compared to say the one on the remastered "Greatest Hits" CD (on A&M
label). All in all, the remastered tracks definitely sound a lot better
than the original ones.

I remember reading it in one of the music mags. I think the webmasters of
the official site might be able to confirm if it's true.

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Date: Sat, 07 Mar 1998 11:09:42 +0100
From: Jens Anders Ravnaas <jensan@online.no
To: greg smith <gsmith@connexus.apana.org.au,
Procol Newsgroup <procol@progrock.org
Subject: Re: Procol Harum - questions

In my opinion, the Anniversary box is well worth the money.The sound quality is improved,
it would bo worth bying for that reason alone. And the 3rd CD holds some very interesting
tracks. I guess most Procolholics would by the box for the Stereo version alone (altough it
is a somewhat dissapointing version imho).
So go and get it!

Not really, Gary singing som Italian words to 'Shine On Brightly'. But, if you are a
completist like me, you would want it anyhow.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jens Anders Ravnaas - Kristiansand - Norway

Life is like a beanstalk. Isn't it?
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
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From: "Samuel Cameron" <samcameron@lineone.net
To: <procol@progrock.org
Subject: grow myself right up to the sky
Date: Sat, 7 Mar 1998 13:59:49 -0000

ok,
does anybody out there think that KR was profoundly influenced
by lewis carroll as a child? there is a case to be made..choose your own
examples..
indeed in the pictures up to about 1971 he could be made into quite a good
animal character in the tenniel illustrations
just off to teatime at the circus
sam
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Date: Sat, 7 Mar 1998 14:38:26 -0500 (EST)
From: Jem33@aol.com
To: brennan2@optonline.net, Procol@progrock.org
Subject: Re: PH Media Exposure

Yes I certainly agree that PH deserves more media exposure. Here are 2 ways
I think they can get it:

1) Remaster and release their vintage LIVE shows -- the Drum Magazines Alone
will be All Over PH when they Finally hear what BJW REALLY sounds like!

2) Add MF's name to the composer credits of AWSoP, where it rightfully
belongs.. Do this publicly with much media hoopla -- explaining the very
understandable oversight that prevented this crediting before.. Then go to
court demanding a better monetary deal on the AWSoP royalties - arguing that
MF's being finally acknowledged as co-composer negates the current raw deal
that G&K now have.. This can help not only PH, but also encourage all the
other musicians who've been shafted by the music biz to take action as well.
-----------------
And in a related story:

Check out MF's page at BtP -- the link to Gary's praise of MF -- for this
great comment from KR:

From: Weekend/The Advocate & Greenwich Time, January 31, 1992
Article and interview with Keith Reid by Frank M. Fedeli
(Fedeli): ".....Fisher adds range and depth to the album. His organ work is
its musical linchpin. It has a dreamy innocence in "Perpetual Motion," soars
and booms in "Man With A Mission."
"Watching Matthew play again, I had forgotten what a talented musician he
was. He is probably the most talented musician I have ever worked with,"
says Reid.
-----------------------------
--- That's well-deserved and very high praise indeed, especially coming
from someone who's worked with so many talented musicians! :-) [jm] <<<<<
----------------------------

KR -- like GB - obviously has a VERY HIGH opinion of MF's musicianship --
and I'm beginning to believe that MF is the" victim" in the "blood on those
tracks" that KR mentioned in his Redhill telegram. If he did mean MF, he
should realze that the problem isn't as horrific and irrevocable as "blood"
-- rather it involves some unfinished business that can still be rectified.
Thankfuly, Despite what happened so many years ago; [reading between the
lines of that 12/72 interview on RT's page at BtP, I infer it may have been
touch&go for awhile but that thanks to RT, disaster was averted in 1972; RT
didn't claim any credit btw - that's my interpretation] -- MF is alive and
well, as brilliant and creative as ever. But he's still owed a huge debt.

So -- Thank You, RT!!!! .Happy Birthday, MF!!! and -- C'mon, Gary and
Keith!!!

Best, Joan
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From: CERDES96 <cerdes@procolharum.com
Date: Sat, 7 Mar 1998 15:09:23 EST
To: Procol@Progrock.org
Subject: MATT

      And I almost forgot....thanks Joan May and BTP for the reminder:
             Happy Birthday to Matthew Fisher!
                                                        cerdes96
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From: "MIKAEL WERKELIN" <mikael.werkelin@mbox301.swipnet.se
To: "procol list" <procol@progrock.org
Subject: Southend
Date: Sat, 7 Mar 1998 22:21:13 +0100

Hi!
Procol played on a single of his in 1969 which was produced by Robin Trower.
His early 70's album was produced for David Knights Productions.
A single fron 1977 was produced by Pete Solley and had Tim Renwick on guitar.
Mick Grabham joined his band after leaving Procol.
Gary Brooker produced one side of his 1978 album
His albums in the late 70's and early 80's was produced for Strongman Management.
His songs were published by Blue Beard Music
Gary Brooker recorded two of his songs for his 1:st solo album
Gary even sounded like him on Chasing for the Chop!
He thanked Keith Reid on one sleeve "for making me an overnight success" (though he never had any success).
Who am I talking about?
I'm talking of Mickey Jupp of course. Can anyone tell me how it comes that so many of the Procol's have been involved in his records? I think Mickey also is from Southend.
/Mikael from Sweden

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From: CERDES96 <cerdes@procolharum.com
Date: Sat, 7 Mar 1998 20:39:25 EST
To: Procol@Progrock.org
Subject: Procol Conspiracy Theory

The Procol Conspiracy Theory: By keeping fans befuddled, they can
continue to omit information, withold rare tapes (like the first album with
Harrison and Royer!!!!) and generally lead us astray as we repeatedly buy the
same old reissues over and over. Makes sense to me......I really would like to
know where that first PH album before Trower and BJ is hiding!!! Well, asking
GB or KR is tantamount to asking Dave Ball or Dave Knights. Useless........no
offense Daves.
CERDES96 of The Colonies
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From: CERDES96 <cerdes@procolharum.com
Date: Sun, 8 Mar 1998 09:11:05 EST
To: Procol@Progrock.org
Subject: Re: Procol Conspiracy Theory

<< In a message dated 98-03-08 07:33:44 EST, you write:

<< i think you impute too much purposeful deception to gb/kr

Naaaaaaa.it' s just a part of an in joke that mushroomed and now
required explaining. No real conspiracy noted...no one benefits. And
yeah...there sure was a lot of convolution about the rarities set. Se what
happened was......KR was in a long trenchcoat and Gb has a hidden mic in his
Homburg........:+)
cerdes96
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Date: Sun, 8 Mar 1998 13:36:14 -0500
To: <procol@progrock.org
From: Alan Semok <asemok@IDT.NET
Subject: Re: conspiracy thoery

CERDES wrote:
I really would like to
know where that first PH album before Trower and BJ is hiding!!! Well, asking
GB or KR is tantamount to asking Dave Ball or Dave Knights. Useless......<<

Right you are Larry...especially since it would be the label they
recorded for that would control the tape of the sessions and any
subsequent release. We can only hope that it still does exist
somewhere...it's pretty shocking to learn how original master tapes of far
more commercially successful albums have been lost, mislaid, and improperly
stored (a good example would be the embarassing Columbia/Simon & Garfunkle
debacle). If they had the bucks to do it, GB & KR could do what Flo &
Eddie (The Turtles) did...they systematically bought back the rights on the
entire body of thier work (including, I understand, video appearances), and
now control all release of thier material themselves.

Actually, a reel I would very much like to hear would be the one
with the "trims" from the Edmonton album, including the numbers they played
with the orchestra sitting it out.
Anybody out there have a "mole" at Chrysalis or A&M?

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Date: Mon, 09 Mar 1998 01:16:06 +0100
From: "webmaster@procolharum.com" <webmaster@procolharum.com
To: procol@progrock.org
Subject: Beyond the Pale website

A few days ago there was a posting on this list that referred to 'Beyond
the
Pale' as if it were an official Procol Harum website. Jens and Roland
would
like to remind everyone that BtP is *not* an official site – it has no
sponsors and no vested interests – it's just something run by a couple
of
fans and a planetful of highly-valued contributors. We're really
flattered
that our labours are so well-received but ... despite some very useful
help
from members of the band in recent weeks ... we're still an unofficial
site,
and we aim to stay that way.

PS!
To celebrate Matthew Fisher's birthday on March 7th, Beyond the Pale
will bring much MF related material this week.
Be shure to visit us at http://www.procolharum.com

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From: CERDES96 <cerdes@procolharum.com
Date: Sun, 8 Mar 1998 21:54:10 EST
To: Procol@Progrock.org
Subject: New York Flower Rain

   On New York Flower Rain ...as I like to called it, or Central Park Live
1969, has anyone ever noticed GB singing the verse that KR said he never
wrote? This is what I hear......
                          "Confusion full scale (mumble mumble)
                                     (Mumble Mumble Mumble)
                           The weeping willow bend their heads
                                     Tomorrow passes by."
Followed by more mumbling. Possibly GB got really lost and somehow came up
with 2 lines that made sense and sounded quite nice or there was another verse
though that's not likely as KR would have included it in the new lyric
amendment at BTP          . Anyone? Anyone?                CERDES96
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From: CERDES96 <cerdes@procolharum.com
Date: Sun, 8 Mar 1998 19:00:49 EST
To: Procol@Progrock.org
Subject: Deram-ification

<< especially since it would be the label they
recorded for that would control the tape of the sessions and any
subsequent release.

Right you are Al...
it's a mystery but I do think someone knows, though
nothing shows!! :+) DERAM/LONDON!! Hmmmmmmmmmm, I wonder if.....
Larry Cerdes96
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From: Dave Lee <d.lee@kudos.co.uk
To: "'Procol@progrock.org'" <Procol@progrock.org
Subject: RE: PH Media Exposure
Date: Mon, 9 Mar 1998 10:21:55 -0000

Why don't we start a world-wide search for the original Hammond Organ
that MF played on AWSoP? (See MF's web page.) We could bolster up the
British press with ideas that the Hammond is part of Britain's heritage.
Maybe we can get a grant from the National Lottery...

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From: Dave Lee <d.lee@kudos.co.uk
To: "'procol@progrock.org'" <procol@progrock.org
Subject: RE: Procol Harum - questions
Date: Mon, 9 Mar 1998 10:23:39 -0000

There can be no excuse for missing A Salty Dog off disc 2 - running time
be buggered. That's like cutting the Mona Lisa down to fit in a smaller
frame!

davelee
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Date: Mon, 09 Mar 1998 18:55:27 +0000
To: <Procol@progrock.org
From: Roland Clare <roland.clare@virgin.net
Subject: RE: PH Media Exposure

At 10:21 09/03/98 -0000, Dave Lee wrote:
Why don't we start a world-wide search for the original Hammond Organ that
MF played on AWSoP? (See MF's web page.) We could bolster up the British
press with ideas that the Hammond is part of Britain's heritage.

[Assuming, then, that the one in Gary's barn that Michael Bywater referred
to in 'Shine On' is not the real AWSoP Hammond!]

I think that if we waited until 'the silly season' there would be a Very
Good Chance of this idea getting off the ground in Britain. Suggest a wording!

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Date: Mon, 09 Mar 1998 18:55:31 +0000
To: CERDES96 <cerdes@procolharum.com, Procol@progrock.org
From: Roland Clare <roland.clare@virgin.net
Subject: Salad words

CERDES96 wrote:
On Central Park Live 1969, has anyone ever noticed GB singing the verse
that KR said he never wrote?

Yes: that concert is the source of the words I sent Keith, which he
disavowed. Incidentally my informant (I haven't heard the tape myself) heard
the words as:

(unintelligible) confusion
The birds fly in the sky
The weeping willow turns my head
And one bird passes by

This is what I hear......
                          "Confusion full scale (mumble mumble)
                                     (Mumble Mumble Mumble)
                           The weeping willow bend their heads
                                     Tomorrow passes by."

Possibly ... there was another verse though that's not likely as KR would
have included it in the new lyric amendment at BTP

As far as I gather that NY69 concert features all the regular 'Salad Days'
words PLUS the variant above; that's why I thought it worth sending to
Keith. Normally in 'Mental Block' mode Gary substitutes mumbled words, but I
don't remember ever hearing a song extended to accommodate those muttered
variants as well as all the original words.

Where in the song do these variant words occur? And are there any other
attestations of the same curious verse?

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From: CERDES96 <cerdes@procolharum.com
Date: Mon, 9 Mar 1998 14:58:38 EST
To: roland.clare@virgin.net, Procol@Progrock.org
Subject: M102 and First Album Searches

In a message dated 98-03-09 13:57:16 EST, RClare writes:<<
[Assuming, then, that the one in Gary's barn that Michael Bywater referred
to in 'Shine On' is not the real AWSoP Hammond!]
I think that if we waited until 'the silly season' there would be a Very
Good Chance of this idea getting off the ground in Britain. Suggest a
wording!

Yes........perhaps. And while we're at it, maybe we can
track down a copy of the first album with Royer and Harrison. That would be
almost as powerful a find. Cerdes96
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Date: Mon, 09 Mar 1998 23:14:22 +0000
To: hani@pacific.net.sg, procol@progrock.org
From: Roland Clare <roland.clare@virgin.net
Subject: Rarities Rumour Confounded

I have heard some rumours that there may be a single CD released
containing rare tracks and B-Sides. Presumably this could be based on the
3rd CD in the Anniversary set. Is this an accurate rumour?

I remember reading it in one of the music mags. I think the webmasters of
the official site might be able to confirm if it's true.

OK, BtP isn't an official site :-) but we do our best. I contacted Westside
and they said there was no plan for a 'freestanding' rarities CD, nor had
they thought of releasing the Anniversary rarities CD separately. I
mentioned that the suggestion had come from this message group and that
there would probably be lots of sales in it, and they took note =96 though
they said they would take no action until sales of the Triple Box have died
out. Incidentally it has done extraordinarily good business, and there's
lots more PH 'product' in the Westside pipeline. More repackaged re-releases
may at first sound drearily predictable ... but it will be worth watching
'Beyond the Pale' soon for details of Westside plans ... and the band's
non-involvement. =20

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From: RBERG51 <RBERG51@aol.com
Date: Tue, 10 Mar 1998 09:33:24 EST
To: procol@progrock.org
Subject: Procol Harum--Isle Of Wight 70

Does anyone know if the set from Procol Harum has ever been released legit or
non legit. Was there a track on the legit Isle Of Wight cd?

Neil
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From: CERDES96 <cerdes@procolharum.com
Date: Tue, 10 Mar 1998 10:08:30 EST
To: RBERG51@aol.com, Procol@Progrock.org
Subject: Re: Procol Harum--Isle Of Wight 70

<< Does anyone know if the set from Procol Harum has ever been released legit
or
non legit. Was there a track on the legit Isle Of Wight cd?

A poor version of Salty Dog is on the released set.(legit) if memory
serves.I never bought it for that reason as well as the generally tedious
performances of a lot of bands I never liked anyway. That festival stuff was
just so much...............hope this helped if somewhat judgemental.
cerdes96
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Date: Wed, 11 Mar 1998 10:12:27 -0500
To: <procol@progrock.org
From: Alan Semok <asemok@IDT.NET
Subject: Re: Isle Of Wight

RBERG51@aol.com wrote:
Does anyone know if the set from Procol Harum has ever been released legit or
non legit. Was there a track on the legit Isle Of Wight cd?<<

        As Cerdes pointed out, the rendition of ASD on the Columbia Records
Isle of Wight set is pretty lame...unfortunately the performance was tired
sounding, the piano out of tune with itself, and the recording itself is
actually far worse than many bootleg tapes I've heard. I'd still like to
hear the whole set, but I suspect that it would be ultimately pretty
disappointing.
        I did manage to connect with a collector some months ago who
actually had it on his list (the time listed was 20 minutes), but lost
contact and subsequent e-mails have bounced . So, it's definitely _out
there_ somewhere. Plus, Sony probably still has the multitracks somewhere
in thier vaults but perhaps they've thrown the key into the sea; I haven't
heard the CD re-release of ISLE, but I understand it was expanded with
additional material..but not additional PH material.
        cheers...
        AL

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Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: procol@progrock.org
From: Terry Earlywine <earlywine@batnet.com
Subject: Shine on Brightly

Does anyone know if there was any promotional prints or posters made from
the American version of the "Shine On Brightly" gatefold album. Who was the
artist, designer, photographer? Do they have other works. I'm interested in
a print from original negatives, if they still exist.

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From: "Samuel Cameron" <samcameron@lineone.net
To: <procol@progrock.org, "Alan Semok" <asemok@IDT.NET
Subject: From the Isle of Wight to Estonia
Date: Wed, 2 Jan 1980 18:44:12 -0000

in confirmation of your message (alan semok)
the new Isle of Wight CD does not have PH on it and
i agree with you all i have the original vinyl IOW salty dog and its weary
isle of wight footage was shown on UKTV last year but PH were not on it
there now seems to be a CD-rom of IOW but i don't know what's on it
does anybody know what happened to the footage shot by MTV in
Estonia a few years ago?

Sam
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From: CERDES96 <cerdes@procolharum.com
Date: Wed, 11 Mar 1998 23:03:27 EST
To: Procol@Progrock.org
Subject: and a ..................

Did he really "...carry(s) a gun and wear(s) a Stetson hat." ? It's
be soooooo quiet in here...........Cerdes96
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Date: Thu, 12 Mar 1998 16:52:34 +1000
To: procol@progrock.org
From: greg smith <gsmith@connexus.apana.org.au
Subject: PH - Bootleg questions

Thanks to everyone who responded to my questions on the Anthology etc
releases. Some interesting, informative and useful responses. The
Anthology has now been ordered. Whilst not held in stock by the local
record store it is a stock item at the distributors. Something I didn't
expect in Australia.

Now to a more contentious question. Bootlegs. Before I get excessively
flamed let me state that I would prefer to buy official live releases
(let's face it they are usually far superior recordings - one per tour
would be nice but unlikely) however if they aren't available then bootlegs
are the next best thing.

I would like to expand my live collection preferably by trading with other
PH fans.

I have:
Easter Island (Fillmore East & LA Troubador 1969) CD
Pilgrims Progress (possibly Beat Club 27 Nov 71 - and maybe a legitimate
release in Germany) Video CD + Audio Cd
Hollywood Bowl (1973 - KBFH - currently en route from the US) CD
Butterfly Boys (London 1 Dec 74) CD
Five & Dime (1976) Cassette from Vinyl
(and of course the Live in Edmonton official release)

I would definitely like to get a good Prodigal Stranger Tour recording plus
any others that may fill the gaps or have rare/exceptional performances. I
have heard that Through the Garden Fence (BBC recordings) is quite good and
that there may be a boot of the full Edmonton Concert.

If there is anyone who wants to trade then please contact me privately (or
publically if you wish). I have a CD writer so I can make both CD and tape
copies for trade. I also have a good CD boot collection of other artists
that should be of interest to Procol fans.

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Date: Thu, 12 Mar 1998 23:03:40 +0000
To: Procol@progrock.org
From: Roland Clare <roland.clare@virgin.net
Subject: new at BtP

Thanks to Keith Reid we now have an authorised text for the 'Salty Dog'
album at 'Beyond the Pale'. See http://www.procolharum.com//text3.htm

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From: CERDES96 <cerdes@procolharum.com
Date: Thu, 12 Mar 1998 22:35:42 EST
To: Procol@Progrock.org
Subject: Ian Wallace

Listening to Procol's 1993 Southend show, I am seriously disappointed
by Ian Wallace on drums. I enjoyed his work on King Crimson's ISLANDS LP from
1972 if memory serves. I had also seen Wallace with Crimso Communication ( :+)
) in 72 with YES and Procol Harum as the headliners and thought he was quite
impressive.His work with PH leaves me flat however. But all those years
ago..two nights of ecstasy ..King Crimson first, then Yes then Procol....the
glory of it all. This Ian Wallace thing had been on my mind for a
while....nothing's better left unsaid and this is one of those times.
CERDES96
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Date: Fri, 13 Mar 1998 17:47:36 +1000
To: procol@progrock.org
From: greg smith <gsmith@connexus.apana.org.au
Subject: re: PH - Bootleg Question

I have only just had a chance to read them and I am preparing full replies
to each of you. So please bear with me and you will all get a reply in the
next day or two.

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From: RBERG51 <RBERG51@aol.com
Date: Fri, 13 Mar 1998 10:11:25 EST
To: procol@progrock.org
Subject: Procol Harum bootlegs

There is a Procol Harum boot called ROBIN'S LAST STAND on Tendolar records out
of Japan. It consists of two shows, England 71 and Copenhagen 71. It
doesn't tell you which one is which. I think the England 71 might be Beat
Workshop, but I haven't crosschecked yet. The track listing on the back is
wrong. Quality is not as good as to what is circulating for Beat Workshop,
but the Copenhagen(if that is the right venue)is quite good.
Neil
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From: Jem33 <Jem33@aol.com
Date: Sat, 14 Mar 1998 00:44:51 EST
To: RBERG51@aol.com, procol@progrock.org
Subject: Re: Procol Harum bootlegs

I ordered this from Bedlam Records but haven't received it yet.. If the
England gig is Beat Workshop, then it doesn't include RT, because Dave Ball
was in the band by the time Beat Workshop was recorded - around xmas time of
1971 as far as I can gather. Gary announced it as the "Christmas Special --
Noel" if that helps identify it.. The tracks on BW include (not necessarily
in this order): QRS, Pilgrim's Progress, Simple Sister, Still There'll Be
More, Power Failure, ASD (with a false start -- "give me 6 bells, BJ" -- and
there's a bit of "Teddybear's Picnic" at the end.. Some versions also include
part of In Held Twas In I. I know i'm leaving some out.

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From: CERDES96 <cerdes@procolharum.com
Date: Sat, 14 Mar 1998 00:56:30 EST
To: Procol@Progrock.org
Subject: Beat Workshop with Dave Ball

<< The tracks on BW include (not necessarily
in this order): QRS, Pilgrim's Progress, Simple Sister, Still There'll Be
More, Power Failure, ASD (with a false start -- "give me 6 bells, BJ" -- and
there's a bit of "Teddybear's Picnic" at the end.. Some versions also include
part of In Held Twas In I. I know i'm leaving some out.

Also included are: Magdalene......Shine On Brightly, In the
Wee Samall Hours of Sixpence, Autumn of My Madness, Look to Your Soul and
Grand Finale.
Cerdes96
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From: CERDES96 <cerdes@procolharum.com
Date: Sat, 14 Mar 1998 19:08:40 EST
To: Procol@Progrock.org
Subject: OH MY GOD!!!!

GO TO BTP! It's about to come to pass............I am in
a stste of shock..(glorious shock)
CERDES96
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From: CERDES96 <cerdes@procolharum.com
Date: Sat, 14 Mar 1998 20:37:31 EST
To: Procol@Progrock.org
Subject: FINALLY!!!!!!!!!!!!

The entire first PH album has been unearthed in
total stereo as it was recorded before that horrific pressing. There are
outakes, alternate versions of songs with Bobby Harrison and ray Royer as
well!!. Shine on B and Quite rightly as well in original undubbed formats
from 1967. Never recorded tracks like Macgregor and Alpha and Robe of Silk
too!! Unreleased Matthew Fisher composition as well with PH from that time
period. A massive treasure trove of material to be released this MAy-
June..............I have been waiting for this a long time.!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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From: bill@progrock.org (Bill Hammell)
To: <Procol@Progrock.org
Subject: Re: FINALLY!!!!!!!!!!!!
Date: Sat, 14 Mar 1998 23:21:58 -0500

Now this is indeed awesome news, it's just a bit of an annoyance to have to
re-buy these CD's yet again. Still very cool news anyway.

       _/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/
      _/ Bill Hammell - bill@progrock.org                              /_/
     _/ List Manager: Kerry Livgren, John Elefante, Rick Wakeman, Yes,/_/
    _/ Procol Harum, Larry Norman E-mail Lists                       /_/
   _/ Kerry Livgren - Art Of The State: http://progrock.org/livgren /_/
_/ John Elefante - Windows: http://progrock.org/elefante         /_/
_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/

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Date: Sun, 15 Mar 1998 13:26:20 +0000
To: CERDES96 <cerdes@procolharum.com, Procol@progrock.org
From: Roland Clare <roland.clare@virgin.net
Subject: Re: FINALLY!!!!!!!!!!!!

It's about to come to pass............I am in a stste of shock..(glorious
shock)

Westside explicitly told me they had not found 'Robe', and no mention was
made of 'MacGregor'. (I know 'Robe' was recorded in 1967, but I've no idea
if 'MacGregor' was recorded)

A massive treasure trove of material to be released this MAy-June ... I
have been waiting for this a long time.!!

Sadly we'll be waiting quite a while for some of it ... only the first album
is scheduled to appear this year.

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From: Bandura520 <Bandura520@aol.com
Date: Sun, 15 Mar 1998 09:19:58 EST
To: procol@progrock.org
Subject: Mantra For May-June

I won't be unhappy about shelling out again for the first PH album. I DO think
the stereo difference is a big reason to be excited. But at the same time I'm
a little concerned by the prospect. Sorta like having a colorized version of
something you can only think about as black and white. Sure hope the stereo
"gloss" doesn't compromise the crisp urgency that I've come to associate the
feel of the first PH LP with. Not going to sweat it. This and the attending
developments are mighty exciting---Bandura520
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From: CERDES96 <cerdes@procolharum.com
Date: Sun, 15 Mar 1998 10:51:51 EST
To: bill@progrock.org, Procol@progrock.org
Subject: Re: FINALLY!!!!!!!!!!!!

I was in error on these two tracks. In the excitement of the
moment I misread the text. All else is there however. Looks like the first
album will be the initial release to be followed sometime later by the other
novelties. BTP is the place to look for the real deal. I would faill miserably
as a scribe in long forgotten days. Forgive the momentary lapse of
reason.....................CERDES96

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From: Bandura520 <Bandura520@aol.com
Date: Sun, 15 Mar 1998 09:19:58 EST
To: procol@progrock.org
Subject: Mantra For May-June

I won't be unhappy about shelling out again for the first PH album. I DO think
the stereo difference is a big reason to be excited. But at the same time I'm
a little concerned by the prospect. Sorta like having a colorized version of
something you can only think about as black and white. Sure hope the stereo
"gloss" doesn't compromise the crisp urgency that I've come to associate the
feel of the first PH LP with. Not going to sweat it. This and the attending
developments are mighty exciting---Bandura520
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From: CERDES96 <cerdes@procolharum.com
Date: Mon, 16 Mar 1998 14:54:23 EST
To: Procol@Progrock.org
Subject: new credits perhaps?

I found the following entry in the PH Guestbook.Does anyone know
anything about this? Cerdes96

Whiter Shade of Pale (98-03-16 15:47:13)
Question: I've wanted to know this for a long time: Who "officially" wrote the
song "Whiter Shade of Pale"? I always thought it was Gary Brooker and Keith
Reid of PRocol Harum. But now i see the article in "Music Publishing Monthly"
that gives the credit to, and I quote, "Loussier/Fisher/Reid/Brooker (adapted
from Bach)." Is this the same Fisher as Matthew Fisher of PRocol? And who is
"Loussier"? I love the Website. This is great! John Mayer Chicago
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Date: Tue, 17 Mar 1998 10:50:41 +0300 (GMT)
To: procol@progrock.org
From: marpe@brecha.com.uy (Marcelo Pereira)
Subject: There is a kind of hush

Hey everybody! So many news about coming releases of rarities in BtP, and
it's been days since the last message. Are we all so astonished that we
can't say a word? Marcelo

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From: Jem33 <Jem33@aol.com
Date: Sun, 15 Mar 1998 12:52:37 EST
To: roland.clare@virgin.net, cerdes@procolharum.com, Procol@progrock.org
Subject: Re: Re: FINALLY!!!!!!!!!!!!

While I'm not too excited about the Royer/Harrison news, and wonder if a
"stereo" verision of Procol's First would be any better sound-wise than the
Mono (stereo can sound putrid too if the mix isn't good and - as Jeff Beck
says - if they "didnt' know where the real DIRT was" -- i.e. in this case -
BJW and the magic sound of the MF/M102 ) - I'm wondering if an early version
of Pandora's Box has surfaced. Was that on the list? I can't get the Web
from here on AOL due to my old slow machine.. I remember Fisher telling Mike
Ober that he recorded Pandora with PH around the time of the first album and
Id LOVE to hear THAT!! It would be interesting to compare it with the 90's
rendition.

Best, Joan :-)
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From: Jem33 <Jem33@aol.com
Date: Tue, 17 Mar 1998 19:59:48 EST
To: cerdes@procolharum.com, Procol@progrock.org
Subject: Re: new credits perhaps?

I have a feeling someone is having a bit of fun with us.. "John Mayer" (no
relation, btw <g) didn't leave an email address - and neither did the
"Jacques Loussier" who posted in the guestbook awhile back either.. I'd like
to request that all the Loussier Jokes be moved over to the Beanstalk, or
preferably to alt.rock-n-roll.classic, where I can do some wordprocessing and
make fewer typos <G.. Or maybe there's an alt.fan.loussier???

No, I think it's the Matthew Fisher who's a professor of theoretical physics
at UC Santa Barbara.

Could be a reference to the American TV icon Loussier Ball (a relative of
Dave's? Who knows?) - connected with PH via BJW who said so eloquently in the
persona of the great Ricky Ricardo - at the Beat Workshop - right before
launching into Power Failure:

Best, Joan ;-)
"And the face of Alice Ghostly
Turned a Wyatt Earp shade of pale."
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From: Biffyshrew <Biffyshrew@aol.com
Date: Tue, 17 Mar 1998 21:28:58 EST
To: procol@progrock.org
Subject: Re: Jacques Loussier

But now i see the article in "Music Publishing Monthly"
that gives the credit to, and I quote, "Loussier/Fisher/Reid/Brooker (adapted
from Bach)." Is this the same Fisher as Matthew Fisher of PRocol? And who is
"Loussier"?

Presumably Jacques Loussier, '60s jazz pianist noted for his trio recordings
of jazzed-up Bach compositions. His records were released in the USA on
London, a label closely allied to Deram. The plot thickens!

Your pal,
Biffy the Elephant Shrew @}-`--}----
...visit me at http://members.aol.com/biffyshrew/biffy.html
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From: hani@pacific.net.sg
Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 10:49:24 +0800
To: Procol@progrock.org
Subject: Help

I'd like to get hold of Matthew Fisher's "Salty Dog Returns" and would be
grateful if anyone of you could tell me if Mike Ober (with his address)
still sells it. Thanks in advance !

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From: CERDES96 <cerdes@procolharum.com
Date: Tue, 17 Mar 1998 22:44:28 EST
To: Procol@Progrock.org
Subject: B.J...............

Barrie James Wilson (98-03-18 04:35:52)
On this anniversary of the birth of B.J. ,I
would simply like to thank him...... wherever he may be (always in our
hearts).....for the untold joy that he has delivered through his rare gift. If
he only knew......I miss you.. most of all, scarecrow.......CERDES96/Larry
Pennisi
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Date: Sun, 15 Mar 1998 23:43:16 +0000
To: Procol@progrock.org
From: Roland Clare <roland.clare@virgin.net
Subject: Pandora

At 12:52 15/03/98 EST, Jem33 wrote:
I'm wondering if an early version of Pandora's Box has surfaced. Was that
on the list?

On 'Shine On Brightly ... plus' (for release 1999?): an instrumental version
of 'Pandora's Box', which Westside are not convinced ever had a vocal track
put on it.

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From: Magnus Lundin <elp@algonet.se
To: Procol@Progrock.org
Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 10:52:46 +0100
Subject: Shine on!

Has the record *Shine on brightly* been released as a CD yet? I've search for
this record for many years!!

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From: CERDES96 <cerdes@procolharum.com
Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 13:13:44 EST
To: elp@algonet.se, Procol@Progrock.org
Subject: Re: Shine on!

<< Has the record *Shine on brightly* been released as a CD yet? I've search
for
this record for many years!!

<A HREF="http://www.thoughtscape.com/pqr.htm"Thoughtscape - p, q, r</A
<--------------------click on this you will find it here. Cerdes96
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From: CERDES96 <cerdes@procolharum.com
Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 17:47:21 EST
To: Procol@Progrock.org
Subject: STEREO GUYS.........STEREO

   Just a quick thought:
                              If we EVER get a straight answer out of Procol
it will be a miracle. Also consider this. In the Ober interviews with
Matthew..........Matthew talks about SOB as if it were the first thing they
did in stereo; blaming Denny Cordell for being resistant to the idea of stereo
recording..... as if the first album was never recorded in stereo at all. He
does not even allude to it. And I always knew this was a load of crumpets
since I have had the stereo Garden Fence and Conquistador since 1970 on an
import LP.......What IS IT with these guys. You would think that they would
remember their own careers. I still remember sessions with my old bands and
what not-- like they were yesterday and PH could have been no more stoned than
we were.. The befuddlement grew .............and grew.   Cerdes96
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From: CERDES96 <cerdes@procolharum.com
Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 20:04:28 EST
To: Procol@Progrock.org
Subject: All this And More

I just finished watching the second Mike Ober interview
with Matthew. I had forgotten all about this great little tidbit. It appears
that Matthew and Gary had both received a packet of words in the post from
Keith, containing the words to All This And More. Matthew said that both he
and Gary wrote separate songs to that set of words, but that when Gary played
his song/melody, Matthew decided not to even bothre telling them that he too
had written a piece of music to it...............just a tidbit that I found
stimulating. I would certainly love to hear Matthew's unsung song.
CERDES96
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From: Jem33 <Jem33@aol.com
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 1998 01:29:12 EST
To: Procol@progrock.org
Subject: Robin's Last Stand

I got that Robin's Last Stand boot and is it riddled with Mistakes! The first
6 or 7 tracks are from the (unnamed) WPLJ gig - not bad sound if turned up
loud - and not the whole gig.. I'm glad they included Juicy John Pink,
Whaling Stories, Simple Sister, Broken Barricades, Memorial Drive, Still
There'll Be More, and SOB - the latter primarily for Gary's bringing in CC's
rendition of the organ solo by shouting "Matthew!--".. . Also track #4, I
think, includes 2 songs - Simple Sister and Nothing That I Didn't Know - the
latter not mentioned in the notes. I WISH Luskus Delph and Power Failure were
on the CD!! PF is listed in the notes, but isn't there.. ASD is listed but
also isn't there - and I'm glad because Gary really sang Flat on it! The rest
of the CD sounds to me to be from the Dave Ball incarnation - not Beat
Workshop, because there's an audience and the songs sound somewhat different -
but I recognize Ball's guitar solo on QRS - actually I prefer that to RT's (o
heresy! <G). The songs on the "Ball" section of the CD include Pilgrim's
Progress (I *don't* like the way Gary sings that!! And Chris has played it
better on other occasions too), QRS, Magdalene, and the last 3 sections of In
Held Twas In I.. Despite the lineup, I really LOVE hearing Grand Finale
without that {{{chorus}}} - the way I WISH they had done it at Redhill. And
BJ sounds great throughout of course. I think Gary does a better job singing
..Autumn.. than Pilgrim's Progress.. [As I was recently Delighted to discover,
the very Best vocal rendition of ..Autumn... Ever, imo, took place at Redhill!
:-) :-) :-) ]

The 2 photos on the CD are (surprise!) in error - kinda compensating for the
errors on the Easter Island boot, where CC was pictured and named but of
course he didn't play. RT's Last Stand makes the opposite mistake - the
photos are of the MF incarnation! One of them depicts the guys in their Clown
Suits, and the Cover photo is that amusing group shot that's in the Westside
Box - wherein Gary, Robin and David look kinda goofy, and MF appears to be
eyeing Gary, with an...interesting expression on his face..

I do recommend this boot for the WPLJ tracks, and even the Dave Ball songs are
largely enjoyable.
--------------------------------------
My standard Bootleg suggestion follows}:
If one must buy a boot - remember that PH get no royalties, and though it's
largely THEIR OWN FAULT ---- grrrrr.......---- for not releasing their
vintage non-orchestrated LIVE material themselves - I suggest compensating
them for their work by buying an extra copy of one of their commercially
available CD's...

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From: Magnus Lundin <elp@algonet.se
To: Procol mailing list <Procol@Progrock.org
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 1998 11:34:54 +0100
Subject: Girbraltar Mailinglist!

I have a question about the Gibraltar Mailinglist. What has happened to it?
I've haven't reciveid any letter for a long time now.

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From: CERDES96 <cerdes@procolharum.com
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 1998 00:08:06 EST
To: Procol@Progrock.org, dimauro@rockvax.rockefeller.edu
Subject: Fisher Interview

Interview with Matthew Fisher
A wonderful interview from Beyond the Pale with Matthew Fisher....of course
there are some of the usual befuddlements like Gary not being able to remember
how to play Dead Man's Dream which Matthew said he would love to
play.--------------------------------------------------------------------
Marcelo Pereira:
30 or 31 years ago, the concept of a quick 'evolution' or 'progression' was
dominating a great part of the rock scene in the USA and England. Month by
month, new albums were 'steps forward', explored new territories, showed new
ways of working in the studio, introduced new sounds, etc. It looked like
staying-the-same was a capital sin. A few years after, some groups still tried
to be 'progressive' (and continued to do so for a long time), but the notion
of a general 'evolution' of rock faded away. What do you remember about that
feeling of 'going further' constantly? When and why do you think that
'movement' reached its limits?

Matthew Fisher:
I was never that interested in 'progressive music'. The only experimental
music that I really enjoyed was the later Beatles albums. I personally never
tried to be 'progressive', I just had a certain way of playing and was simply
mixing my influences (Pop, R&B, Jazz, Classical, Blues, etc.)

Though Procol Harum is generally considered a precursor of 'symphonic' or
'progressive' rock, I think the band always had one foot firmly on R&B, and
that made a great difference. In fact, one of the most surprising things in
Procol was the combination of some virtues that seldom appear together. Was
that a result of tensions among individuals, or a collective and conscious
effort to assemble this and that, in the service of a global outcome?

I don't remember any tensions as far as the music was concerned. We all liked
the way the other members of the band played and each contributed what they
could. The R&B thing was probably what we all had in common, and was
inevitable with Gary being the singer! I think all the while Rob and I were
both in the band, we just 'did our thing'. I think the trouble with our
respective replacements was that they were too worried about 'playing in a
Procol style'. Rob and I didn't have to worry about that because we defined
the style!

With all the due respect to other musicians, I think that the original organ
and guitar sound of Procol couldn't be 'replaced', nor could the band, in my
opinion, 'replace' the contribution you and Trower made to the musical
decisions, beyond 'playing your parts'. Looking back, and leaving aside the
details and incidents, do you think that Procol lost original members when the
'musical balance' couldn't be kept, or, on the contrary, that 'musical
balance' was a victim of the departures?

Hmmm. I think I've more or less answered that one already. I think the
'musical balance' just resulted from the respect we had for each other and the
material. For instance, neither I nor Rob played on the track A Salty Dog.
This wasn't because we didn't like the song (far from it) but because we
honestly felt there was nothing we could add that wouldn't 'take away' from
what was already there.

When it came to making musical decisions, was there a 'democracy' or a
'hierarchy' in the band?

Not exactly a hierarchy. I suppose Dave and BJ didn't hold as much influence
as the other three, but that was only because they didn't seem to want to.
Musically Procol was a democracy all the while I was in it.

Did all members share the profits equally (leaving aside that problem of the
song credits), or were some members paid by other members?

The trouble was that all the while I was in the band, there were no profits!
The band had a succession of useless managers and that situation didn't
improve until they signed with Chrysalis, which was way after my time. During
my time in the band I believe such profits as there were, were split equally.
However, the income from songs (particularly WSoP) made these amounts
insignificant.

Is it true that you were about to rejoin the band some time after leaving, and
finally didn't? If it's true, what happened?

I had a few problems with Procol around that time, concerning a Hammond organ
which I'd lent them and which they had lost and also the matter of my
producer's royalties for the Salty Dog album, which they weren't paying.

From Home to Something Magic, did you ever listen to some Procol song and
think: 'I would really have liked to play it, I would have played this instead
of that'? (You should know that many of us, fans, have dreamed of hearing you
play in those records).

I think Home came out pretty well, because Rob 'expanded' to fill the gap that
might have resulted from my departure. I personally don't miss me on that
record! All the same, I'm not very familiar with those albums. We've played
some of the songs on stage and I deliberately didn't listen to the recorded
versions until I'd worked out a part to play. So rather than say I wish I'd
played on the recordings, I can say I enjoy playing songs like Grand Hotel,
Whaling Stories, Strong as Samson, New Lamps for Old, Nothing But the Truth,
Piggy Pig Pig etc. (I'd love to play The Dead Man's Dream, but Gary can't
remember how it goes!) I've no idea what I might have played had I been in the
group at the time, though.

I have read that your participation in The Prodigal Stranger wasn't really
like being a member of a group, but something like being a guest composer and
player (much more involved than Trower, but a guest anyway), on a project that
began without you. How do you feel about that album?

That's not quite accurate. I was very involved, although I didn't see all the
tracks from their inception. My feeling is not that I didn't feel like a
member of a group as much as it just wasn't a group. If the album sounds a bit
too 'produced' I expect I'm as much to blame as anyone for that. With the
benefit of hindsight I wouldn't want to do another album that way.

Would you like to work again with Brooker and Reid? If it were your decision,
how would you like to do it?

On the one hand I like working with Keith and Gary. However, there are only 24
hours in a day and 365 days in a year and I'm not as young as I used to be! I
have to think carefully before I commit myself to anything that will take up a
large chunk of my precious time. Another problem with Keith and Gary is that
they regard Procol as their own pet project and don't really give too much
away. I've no idea how many copies Prodigal Stranger sold, what advance they
received, how much the album cost to produce, etc. Musically, I was strongly
involved in the album, but from a business point of view I was an outsider. Of
course, I wouldn't have had the necessary funds to invest in the project, but
then there are historical reasons for that!

From a strictly musical point of view, I suppose I wouldn't mind working on
another Procol album if it could be more like a 'real band' (the way it used
to be). However, there is more than just the music to consider ....

Marcelo writes for the Uruguayan weekly, Brecha, on politics and occasionally
music. Read his wonderful Procol Harum feature, A Romance at a Distance,
written specially for 'Beyond the Pale'

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From: Jem33 <Jem33@aol.com
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 1998 08:52:01 EST
To: Procol@progrock.org
Subject: Beautiful B.J. Wilson Tribute!

If you haven't done so already - check out Larry Pennisi's new BJW pages at
BtP - listed under "what's New?" for March 18, or go directly to
http://www.procolharum.com/larryspict9a.htm

Many Thanks to Larry Pennisi for his wonderful pages in praise of the great
B.J. Wilson on this the date of B.J.'s birth. This is the kind of tribute I
wish had been included in the liner notes for Prodigal Stranger. Perhaps
Larry's great words and photos can be used on a future PH release - i.e. a
showcase for B.J.in the form of Vintage non-orchestral LIVE performances.
I'll keep advocating for such a release until it happens! Thanks again,
Larry!! :-) <<

Best, Joan :-)
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From: Phast <Phast@aol.com
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 1998 17:22:27 EST
To: procol@progrock.org (Procol)
Subject: STEREO .... STEREO

It is my understanding -- and Mr. Brooker has stated -- that the early (1967)
stuff was recorded on a "four track machine," with something like vocals on
one track, guitar on another, organ and bass on another, and piano and drums on
the other. (I may have the mix of instruments wrong, but that's the right idea.)
Anyway, these four tracks were all "mixed down" to MONO for the first album.
However, the four-track master tapes (if they still exist) could/can be re-
mixed in [at least limited] STEREO. I have always contended that the first stereo
version of Homburg on the Westside box (and which has been available for years on CD)
is the exact same performance as the mono Homburg. However, to me, the stereo
version of Conquistador on the Westside box (and which has been available for years,
though not on CD), sounds like a different performance than the mono Conquistador.
Finally, to me, the stereo version of "Garden Fence" (also available for years on CD) is a
toss-up -- it sounds very, very close to the mono version, but the ending (with BJW's
drums) sounds a little different.
In any event, the key is the "four track machine." If the first album was
actually "recorded in MONO," wouldn't it have been a "one track machine?" I also think
that the liner notes to the Westside box address this when they say that the stereo
AWSOP was only RECENTLY mixed in stereo. That would mean that ***SOMEONE*** finally
gained access to the four-track master tapes. (Maybe Keith Reid had a garage sale
when those "builders" were at his place in New York last July?)

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From: Phast <Phast@aol.com
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 1998 17:22:29 EST
To: procol@progrock.org (Procol)
Subject: Upcoming Rarities/Reissues -- APPROVED or UNAPPROVED by PH ???

We can only hope that Westside will hurry up with these reported
Rarities/Reissues -- before the ever-shrinking base of the already
miniscule Procol Harum cult following shrivels up, withers away, or
keels over from old age!

"Hey, Ma', turn up my hearing aid so I can hear that stereo .... What? I said
STEREO! .... version of 'Seem to Have the Blues (Most All the Time)'. Oh,
hell, wait a minute -- I've got to change my catheter first."

"Dammit, Pa', did you go and blow our Social Security check again on that
'Purple Hair' group?! What'd they offer you this time? -- 'Robe of Silk' live with
Dave Ball? They saw you comin', you old fool. And don't pee on the floor!"

Of course, if these reported Rarities/Reissues are UNAPPROVED by Brooker
and/or Reid, then I won't buy them, anyway. HA! HA! HA! -- That's a good one! (By the
way, Gary and/or Keith and/or Westside: The single, and perhaps only, greatest thing
about the Westside box "rarities" CD, IMHO, is the "UNAPPROVED" second stereo version of
Homburg. It alone is worth the 35 clams I paid. The next time I pay with oysters!)

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From: Phast <Phast@aol.com
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 1998 17:22:30 EST
To: procol@progrock.org (Procol)
Subject: Robin's [partial] Last Stand

Jem33: Thanks for the info on the "Robin's Last Stand" bootleg. Only half
Trower
(WPLJ) and half Ball, huh? Well, I'll save my money on that bootleg turkey;
thus
avoiding the indignity of buying yet another official and/or APPROVED reissue
as
compensation to "the band." (My goodness, I'm starting to sound like DEDACTR!
Hey, maybe I am DEDACTR!)

DEDACTR ... er, PHAST
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From: Phast <Phast@aol.com
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 1998 17:22:25 EST
To: procol@progrock.org (Procol)
Subject: Re: Pandora's Box, Robe of Silk, and other Rarities

In recalling my memories and accounts from Redhill, I remember hearing that
Henry ("Mr. Liner Notes") Scott-Irvine, in conjunction with Westside, had
discovered a tape with no less than 8 or 9 takes of "Pandora's Box" from 1967.
(Of which Mr. Fisher -- Hi Matthew! -- reportedly remembers NOTHING!) But
nothing was said about whether those takes were with or without vocals.

In retrospect, I don't remember anything specific being said about "Robe of
Silk" -- and maybe even "MacGregor" -- that might have just been a misinter-
pretation (or "wishful thinking") by some of us there. (Although I think
that "MacGregor" may have been mentioned in that one [Mojo?] article about
the rarities?)

All of the other [hopefully] upcoming Rarities news seems to jive with what I
remember at Redhill -- except that "The Gospel According to Matthew" is a new
one on me that I didn't hear about at all.
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From: CERDES96 <cerdes@procolharum.com
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 1998 17:35:33 EST
To: Procol@Progrock.org
Subject: well..uh..ya see.. we uh..I can't seem to recall..uh

<< Henry ("Mr. Liner Notes") Scott-Irvine, in conjunction with Westside, had
discovered a tape with no less than 8 or 9 takes of "Pandora's Box" from
1967.
(Of which Mr. Fisher -- Hi Matthew! -- reportedly remembers NOTHING!)

I expected this to happen. PH never remembers anything about
anything that pertains to them, but that's what makes it all the more fun.
Sorting out the chaff from the grain; the flotsam from the
jetsam......................let's keep our ears peeled. Damn hearing aid fell
into the CD cradle............Maaaaaaaa?? Got a fork I can fish that darn
thing out with??
CER (cough cough squint) DES96
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From: CERDES96 <cerdes@procolharum.com
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 1998 17:36:22 EST
To: Procol@Progrock.org
Subject: ooops.......

<< IMHO, is the "UNAPPROVED" second stereo version of
Homburg.
It alone is worth the 35 clams I paid.

Damn Straight Pat..............Matthew's intensified Baroque
organ convolutions are worth the price of admission alone. Can't wait to hear
the rest. I do believe though that the stereo G.Fence is the same except that
the original is faded out. This I think is the same but with the ending (The
sailors dance) left intact concluding with Barries drum roll. The only
difference on Conquistador seems to be the organ solo with the mistake in it
and the remixed vocal. The rest sounds like the original. See ya soon mates
cerdes96
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Part two of the March archives (we split this one as it's such a whopper)